OKAY. An open question here

[serai]

In the aftermath of the Discovery of Cockzilla, I'd like to ask everybody a question:


Just what the hell is wrong with Speedos, anyway?


I'm serious. I really don't get the whole EWWWW reaction. We saw a damn fine-looking guy wearing a garment that shows off his assets. Assets that most of the folks I hang with on LJ at the very least have been wondering about for a while, if not writing intricate pervy fics about. We got a good look at Sean's entire physique here (well, except for his feet). Granted, he's not exactly svelte, but some of us like a man with enough flesh to hang onto, you know.

Yeah, there's the "guys who shouldn't wear them" idea. But what's that got to do with the garment itself? It's hardly more revealing than a fucking THONG, for gods' sakes, and we see those damn things on the beach constantly. (In fact, it's less revealing - at least it covers the guy's buttcrack, damnit!) Why is it ho-hum for a woman to hang all her bits out to dry but outrageous for a man to do the same?

And all this shrieking and turning green from women who amuse themselves by writing about men porking each other, creating pics out of gay porn, and squeeing endlessly about how hot and fuckable their guys are? I'd have thought you all would be hopping with joy to see one of your fantasy guys wearing something that revealing. What gives???

Really, explain this to me. And cite reasons, please, not just "They just squick me!" Because it makes no sense to me at all.

Comments

wot wot?

[undone27.livejournal.com]

I must have missed the "eew" response, because the responses to the pics that I saw were more of the "break me off a piece of that" variety. Maybe that's because most of the people that are active on my flist are a bit more how you say mature about their sexuality and maybe just a little size queenly? *snerk*

Re: wot wot?

[serai1.livejournal.com]

Oh there was plenty of that, and I'm totally with it - I'd fuck that guy on a hot rock! But I'm talking about the reaction to what he was wearing. There's a lot of Speedos-are-horrible! going on here, and I just do NOT get that. I LOVE seeing a fine man's package, thank you.

Re: wot wot?

[undone27.livejournal.com]

We, as a society (Amurka) have been socialized to AVOID THE PACKAGE and for straight men to hide their groins under folds of cloth from other men's eyes, which is ridiculous. If I remember correctly, there's a beach somewhere in New Jersey that actually banned Speedos because "the gays" only wore them. Feh.

Re: wot wot?

[serai1.livejournal.com]

*SIGH* It's sad how far back we've slid in the last couple of decades. Used to be so much fun grooving on a hot man's ass, to say nothing of the other treasures.

*waxes nostalgic for the 70's*

Re: wot wot?

[elderberrywine.livejournal.com]

It's quite odd, you know. Having gone to high school during the era of the great Cultural Revolution (Summer of Luuuv, baby!), the trend that both sexes have embarked on, apparel-wise, since then is quite odd.

Females have uncovered bits that even we, in our most mini-skirted, hot pantsed heyday, would not have dreamed of uncovering (and despite all so-called dress codes, too).

Whereas the males feel naked without at least three shirts on, and the baggiest of jeans. And even wear their boxers under their swimshorts when they are at the beach.

Sigh. So much for the Revolution.

*wanders back into her cave*

Re: wot wot?

[serai1.livejournal.com]

Oh, I know! I mean, as free-thinking as I am, I was scandalized when Rose McGowan showed up to the Grammy Awards naked. NAKED. She had on this strange thing consiting of loops of chains that didn't cover ANYTHING, and a pair of fuck-me shoes. And even those were just heels held on by one little strap. And nobody even batted an eye! No matter how good I would look, you'd never catch me doing that in public.

Re: wot wot?

[serai1.livejournal.com]

for straight men to hide their groins under folds of cloth from other men's eyes

Gee, maybe us women should use the same excuse to avoid wearing thongs and bikinis and other uncomfortable things designed to appeal to men's perv factors. Short skirts, too. And pantyhose and push-up bras and low-cut blouses and fuck-me shoes.

No, no, I can't wear those! Some LESBIAN might get horny thoughts and try to grab me!

Wonder if it would work?

[myladylyssa.livejournal.com]

I don't get it either. *is puzzled* I am not even of that persuasion, but I enjoy oggling just so. :)

[serai1.livejournal.com]

Totally! Boxers are so lame. They're like throwing a rug over a work of art. Not to mention sexist.

[semyaza.livejournal.com]

There's a weird sort of puritanism at work here, similar to the one that caused Lij's nipples to be edited out on the Flipper DVD.

[ex-lunarisi.livejournal.com]

Elijah's NIPPLES were edited out of the DVD?!? WTF. I knew about the happy shorts being cropped but his nips too? Arg.

I don't get it either. I was all HOLY SHIT MOTHER OF GOD LOOKIT THAT CHRISTINE WILL YOU SHARE IT PLEASE? when I saw the pics. Yeah, some men don't belong in speedos, just like some women don't belong in bikinis. But that doesn't mean the garment itself is bad; when worn properly it's great!

[semyaza.livejournal.com]

Yup. They cropped the nips. It's a strange world we're living in.

As for Speedos--bring 'em on. Or off, as the case may be.

[undone27.livejournal.com]

True, there was some cropping done on the DVD, which is just an EGREGIOUS OUTRAGE, in my opinion. *clings to VHS copy*

Yeah I'm a perv.

[semyaza.livejournal.com]

I try not to play the happy shorts sequence too often. Wouldn't want to break the tape. :)

[serai1.livejournal.com]

It was the only Elijah hardon captured on film, and those Nazis had to take it away from us! *sob*

[serai1.livejournal.com]

Christ in a sidecar! With a helmet and goggles! What, are we supposed to be teaching our kids that guys don't have nipples now? That's kinda like airbrushing a guy's nose off his face. Hell, I'd think kids would be traumatized by seeing Elijah with a weirdly deformed chest area!

And just who did Disney make the damn film for, anyway? I thought it was for kids, and I don't recall any 10-year-olds I've ever met having lustful fantasies about a guy's nips. You know, it's amazing how perverted and dirty-minded censors can be. For all that they claim to be "protecting" people, can you think of anybody that would be harmed by seeing a perfectly normal chest on a guy in swim gear? Even a really young one?

[semyaza.livejournal.com]

It brought to mind the bathing suits that men used to wear--at least, they wore them on public beaches in certain parts of the world--that went from chest to groin. I have a pic of my father and grandfather (my father was about ten) wearing them. Not only were they long, but the top part extended down over the 'briefs' section to cover anything that might be visible.

It would never have occurred to me in a million years that anyone nowadays would even think to crop out a teenage boy's nipples. Where would someone's mind have to be to look at a film that way?

I agree about Speedos. I think they're nifty.

[elderberrywine.livejournal.com]

Dang, what is it about the poor guy's nipples that seem to bug the censors so? First LOTR, and now Flipper?

*grumbles*

We definitely need some bare-chested Lij (if not more) in whatever flick he does next.

Airbrush this, censors!

[serai1.livejournal.com]

LOTR? Was there a problem with his nips in LOTR? I hadn't heard about that!

[elderberrywine.livejournal.com]

Well, there was one gloriously on display as Frodo lounged back on the bed at Rivendell, robe sliding silkily open, and Sam approaching with an outstretched hand. At least it was on display as FOTR was in the theaters. But when it was issued on video, the robe, alas, no longer slides open. Pah. And poor Sam is left reaching for only Frodo's hand.

[semyaza.livejournal.com]

Could have knocked me over with a feather. The film isn't as good without the nipples. In fact, it amazes me that any film can get a G-rating these days, if even nipples are too hot for children's eyes to see.

[mews1945.livejournal.com]

I agree with you about the speedo thing. When I saw the pictures I thought, man, I'd like to lay my head on that tummy and nuzzle in and run my fingers through all that fur. The whole thing is beautiful. I grew up in an era when people of both sexes had to dress a certain way to be thought "decent" and lemme tellya, it was a sucky way to grow up. I don't like to see kids dressed as hookers, a la Britney, or the Olsen twins, but when I see an adult male or female showing off what Nature, in Her generosity, gave, I can totally appreciate it. Go, Seanie. Luff you.

[serai1.livejournal.com]

Go you. There's a difference between wearing something revealing and something suggestive. I gag when I see what young women aspire to these days. What the hell ever happened to dignity and pride of self?

Pity nudism never caught on here, because I think this damn country could use some desensitizing when it comes to this kind of thing. See enough things like that Speedo and naughty bits lose their titillating quality, and become just another part of the body. But that would be too level-headed and logical, methinks. Can't have that.

[mews1945.livejournal.com]

Amen to that. This idea that sex and bodies are "dirty" is mostly a 'Murican hangup, at least in the civilized world. It's like other things that are "taboo" here. My grandson went to Germany, Switzerland, Italy and, I think Austria with a school group, and he was telling me about how kids of 17 and 18 can drink legally there, and to them, it's not about the drinking, it's about being with friends and talking. They drink a beer or two in an evening. Over here, it's about getting shit-faced and throwing up. I think we Americans are a truly fucked up people. But I could be wrong.

[serai1.livejournal.com]

I totally agree. Americans in general have no sense of proportion when it comes to things like this. Our society doesn't encourage moderation, or an appreciation of it. It's all or nothing, and that's both counterproductive and very sad.

Your example is great. My dad started my sibs and I on very weak wine coolers when we were little, which is the custom in Spain (where he's from). And we never developed a taste for alcohol except for wine and beer as an accompaniment to meals. I've never understood why Americans love to drink so much, especially hard liquor. Ick. Nasty stuff. And it's like that with everything here, whether it's alcohol or sex or drugs or money or whatever. Nobody knows how to take something only as much as you need or will add a little enjoyment to life. Either you roll around in it until you're sick, or you can't have ANY of it, EVER. It's a very weird illness, if you ask me.

[mews1945.livejournal.com]

So right. I used to love mixed drinks, and wine, and when my daughter was just small, if she asked to taste my drink, I'd let her have a sip. She grew up realizing she could have it if she wanted it. Now, she'll drink a wine or a mixed drink on special occasions, but it just doesn't matter to her. Don't know why we all seem to have that "all or nothing" mentality here, but it's so pervasive. Maybe it has something to do with the fact we're bombarded 24/7 with advertising telling us we have to have everything, all the time, and right now?

[serai1.livejournal.com]

It's partly that, and it's partly the fact that this country was settled by a bunch of tight-assed Puritans. We've internalized that whole mindset, and since willful self-deprivation is not something Nature has any sympathy for, the result is a kind of societal paranoid dualism. We're constantly afraid of relaxing and unclenching, giving in to what we want without stressing over it, even though evidence shows time and again that if you stop with the prohibitions, the desired object loses its fascination and becomes just another thing. I think we've gotten to the point where Americans like being all wound up and paranoid and disapproving - it's a way to feel righteous about our fucked-up society.

*shrug* Gringos. Go figure.

[mews1945.livejournal.com]

I think you just summed it all up perfectly. Gringos. Go figure.

[elasg.livejournal.com]

I must have missed the whopla, but I happen to like speedos. ;) I'm not crazy about what was wearing them in your example, but as a garment, I quite like them. It's a pleasure to see things clearly. No one should feel uncomfortable about showing off their assets. :D

[serai1.livejournal.com]

I'm not crazy about what was wearing them in your example

You mean Sean? I think he looks lovely. Very grabbable.

[elasg.livejournal.com]

Meh, he's never done much for me. I think it's the personality more than anything else.

Now lij in such attire I would SERIOUSLY go for, but he's a sworn boxer man. *Pout* Life just isn't fair!

[rodneyscat.livejournal.com]

I'm not a big fan of speedo's in general, not even on my hubby (but he hates wearing boxers, so that's just tough shit for me). When I look at a guy/man in a 'ooh, niccccce!' kind of way, I almost always think about touching, and imho speedo's feel 'ew', plus the package gets squashed so, and I like things to hang loose. Or stand loose (and have room for it). Boxers are more inviting to me; not a squashed bulge, but something you can play with.

By the way: I think thongs are incredibly un-sexy, both for women and men, no matter how fantastic the ass is.

[lurea-aure.livejournal.com]

I missed the brouhaha! Any chance of giving a link to the infamous pics?

I think Sean is cute--not in a sex god type of way, but cute. And I have most certainly appreciated a man in Speedos from time to time. :drool:

[rodneyscat.livejournal.com]

Here's a link to the pic (http://www.livejournal.com/users/beizy/799889.html).

I'm all about loose and comfy clothes, both for women and men.

[serai1.livejournal.com]

Take a look at my last post. There's a link to all the pics there.

[serai1.livejournal.com]

There you go. Thank you for telling me your reasons.

I like comfy clothes too. I never wear high heels or pantyhose or any of that slavery crap. What bothers me is the fucking sexism implicit in men being all shrinky and virginal about showing their bodies, but insisting that a woman is not sexy if she doesn't show hers. That is just right out. If we gotta do it, they gotta do it.

And I do enjoy seeing a hot guy showing off his bits. I don't think Speedos actually squash anything, just hold 'em in safely. After all, they were designed to be used by professional swimmers to keep things from flopping around and getting in the way (like sports bras, which I love wearing), so if they were painful or uncomfortable, they wouldn't have caught on.

[blackbird-song.livejournal.com]

My antipathy to Speedos is that they have, in my opinion, been designed to be supremely unflattering on just about every body, including those which most people find supremely sexy. I also find them offensive for the same reasons that I do thongs and other such garments: they objectify the people wearing them without honoring them. The human body is beautiful, and deserves to be shown off fully, and to its best advantage.

I do not advocate that men should only wear boxers; far from it, although some men look cute in them, and the knowledge that they are comfortable and give the boys room to breathe is also sexy, to me. I just wish that someone could design a brief garment similar to Speedos that sat better on the body and showed things off without seeming to squash anything.

Another part of my aversion to them, I think, stems from the fact that I've known numerous guys who've had to wear dance belts, and Speedos tend to remind of those instruments of torture. (All the men I've known who've worn them complain bitterly about what they do to their bits.)

All of that having been said, I am enormously grateful to have been afforded such a gorgeous view of Sean in (nearly) all his glory. The color isn't great for him, but I don't care. They could have put him in a lime green pair, and I would only have been one angstrom less thrilled. I am very grateful that he had the cojones (as it were) to wear that costume with such sweet grace, and I shall be blushing the color of that outfit when I meet him again at ELF. (And I won't tell him why! *g*)

Thanks for this post, and for letting us weigh in on this!

Catherine

[serai1.livejournal.com]

*shrug* It's a matter of taste, I guess. I have no inherent objection to them at all; they just look like underwear to me. I don't get what's unflattering or objectifying about them. They level the playing field, moreover, and that I certainly don't object to. If women are going to be forced into showing their bodies for the sake of men's fun, the least men can do is reciprocate. What's it gonna do, kill them?

And the gods know, most men that I've met do not have half the problems with being ogled by women as women do vice versa. In fact, a lot of them love it. Which is why the whole double standard puzzles me. I think Undone is right above, and the unfairness resulted from straight guys getting more and more antsy about the possibility of gay guys looking at them. *eyeroll*